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Post by fleabitten on Aug 9, 2010 20:48:30 GMT
Was watching a bit of dublin horse show on tv which i had recorded and wondered something.
Is it really necessary for those horses to have such complicated looking entanglements of nosebands, bits, reins and martingales? Some bits had really long shanks, some riders with 2 sets of reins.
I also saw one rider with a snaffle with a flash and that was it. And another one with a cavesson noseband and a snaffle and running martingale. I thought that was very refreshing to see after all them other ones jumping with a load of gear on. Plus the one with no martingale did the first clear round inside the time as far as i can remember.
I dont even know if this sort of thing is the same in eventing?
Perhaps these horses need it? I dont know enough about registered jumping to know about this sort of thing though...
any ideas?
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arumanii
Apprentice Poo Picker
Posts: 360
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Post by arumanii on Aug 10, 2010 18:53:13 GMT
From what I've seen locally: most ppl seem to use a breastplate with running martingale attachment (kind of sensible really just in case) 70% of ppl use faaar to heavy a bit in my opinion (at least when they're pretty much leaning on it or hauling back just before a jump!  ) usually in combination with a flash or drop noseband They are never usually as harsh or over tacked as seen on the international horse shows tho. I did once see another rider with just the breastplate (no martingale attachment) and an english hackamore (no it wasn't me in the mirror but that is what i tend to use jumping xc) I agree, its always refreshing to see ppl riding in light tack and not being heavy handed with the horses - shame its only the odd few we seem to see... |
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Post by fleabitten on Aug 10, 2010 19:06:28 GMT
yeah i think maybe some of them were hackamores.
but really, are all those horses so uncontrollable that they need all that stuff? i wonder why the worst display of over tacking is seen on international horses? i wonder if people just like to copy them for the look of the thing. perhaps thats a bad generalisation.
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Post by brigadier on Aug 17, 2010 18:04:09 GMT
When it comes to making money then anything goes or so it seems. I think some riders simply need more brakes, whether the horse needs it or not. The danger is that although these bits can be okay in professional hands they can set a trend and when copied can do irrepairable damage. One case in example is the dutch gag which was practically unheard of in this country fifteen years ago. A trainer I know used it for long reining as it was soft but gave brakes if needed, essential when long reining big young horses. But she would never have used it for most riding purposes and never in novice hands as it can cause a horse to over bend and 'break' its neckline. Now its on lots of horses as a general riding bit and IMO is simply too strong for a novice rider. Shame really and it is nce to see a good horse doing a good round with simple equipment.
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 1, 2011 15:19:53 GMT
one of mine is in a breastplate a rubber pelim a grackle and a flash as she is very strong and can be known for headbutting however another one of mine who is the same very feisty is in a snaffle and a flash it all depends on the horse and the rider i think personally x
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Post by spotti on Feb 1, 2011 17:18:16 GMT
I didn't think you could put a flash on a grackle  Or am I thinking of the wrong noseband...a grackle is that cross-over X-shaped thing isn't it? |
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Post by scattymare on Feb 1, 2011 17:46:24 GMT
Yes Spotti you're right. How do you have a flash and a grackle??
And I wouldn't be using either with a pelham. How can you fit a flash strap with a curb chain??
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Post by fleabitten on Feb 1, 2011 20:56:12 GMT
It doesn't really make sense  Am not against the use of grakles, flashes, pelhams etc but dont see how they can go together. |
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Post by maximum on Feb 1, 2011 22:01:41 GMT
rather than shutting down your horses mouth with two nosebands ( which will also prevent the pelham acting in the way it should) perhaps you could try schooling it and teaching it to accept the hand.
i wont say any more as I am very angry and may say something I regret. No horse deserves to be treated like this.
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Post by Jen on Feb 1, 2011 22:43:14 GMT
rather than shutting down your horses mouth with two nosebands ( which will also prevent the pelham acting in the way it should) perhaps you could try schooling it and teaching it to accept the hand. i wont say any more as I am very angry and may say something I regret. No horse deserves to be treated like this. i agree completely with maxi, a pelham is a harsh enough bit as it is without TWO nosebands strapping the mouth shut as well. |
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 9:31:04 GMT
Right thats up to you your not the one showing results that me and her is! lol how funny a grackle has the flash that is already attached it acts as a flash!
a rubber pelham is harsh now is it ok... if you no how to use it properly then no its not aint going to waste my time clearly dont understand do we! ha
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Post by jack on Feb 2, 2011 11:09:18 GMT
Right thats up to you your not the one showing results that me and her is! lol how funny a grackle has the flash that is already attached it acts as a flash! a rubber pelham is harsh now is it ok... if you no how to use it properly then no its not aint going to waste my time clearly dont understand do we! ha we have some very experionced people on here surly at 18yrs you still have a lot to learn not being funny but the horses are in 24/7 youve have already said one is strong and one is feisty, your using god knows how many nosebands and a nasty harsh bit is it not time now to stand back and look at these horses again is there something wrong could be anything teath back etc feed or being stabled 24/7 ect the rider there coats may well shine and eyes bright doesnt mean they are happy for some reason have u tryed nh you would learn so much |
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 11:16:02 GMT
lol we have a vet and farrier on site 24/7 they have there back done every 6 months and a sport massage every 3 weeks i think you will find they are fine they are feisty they enjoy there job and sucseed very well at yes i may only be 18 years old but i am trained by the best riders in the uk laura renwick who is englands leading rider im sure if something was up she would mention! your entitle to your opinon the same way that i am
im happy with them and my results with them and so are they
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Post by jack on Feb 2, 2011 11:19:18 GMT
lol ? sorry did i say something funny
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 11:23:37 GMT
yeah you did made me laugh! dont see how u can say a horse that is showing these results and doing well loving happy horses but apparently there not!
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Post by jack on Feb 2, 2011 11:31:16 GMT
i never said they werent happy i just think if we are having problem which you seemed top be ( with the bit and the 2 nosebands) that it might be time to step back and look at things again like i have said it could be a number of things
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 11:39:10 GMT
they have a grackle and a rubber pelim where is there 2 nosebands and no there isnt a problem, but when you need to get your horse sitting on the hocks mainly for puissance i need a stronger bit what does that mean every horse that isnt in snaffle has a problem? sorry just dont understand what you mean?
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Post by scattymare on Feb 2, 2011 12:19:26 GMT
As your so experienced I'm surprised you don't know that it's called a Pelham, not a pelim. And please tell me how the curb action of this bit works with a flash/grackle strap on.
Jack, don't let her wind you up....I've got som etroll spray round here somewhere.....
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 12:24:40 GMT
No the grackle acts as a flash surely you would no that....
it goes round and keeps there mouth shut acting like a flash
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 12:26:11 GMT
and i dont remember saying that i am soo experienced? sorry can you tell me when i said that?
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Post by scattymare on Feb 2, 2011 12:56:29 GMT
I'd kind of read this that someones pretty experienced wouldn't you?
I know what you're trying to say about the grackle having a 'flash' strap but a flash and a grackle are two completely different nosebands. And as I said earlier, how does the curb chain (thats part of the pelham not the noseband) work with a flash strap - or the bottom strap of a grackle?
Either or, they contradict each other.
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 12:58:16 GMT
the bottom of the grackle goes round and the curb chain clips on the hook very loosely common sense
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Post by fimacg on Feb 2, 2011 13:00:55 GMT
echo Scatty, the grackle and the curb are both supposed to be used independantly as they both act on the lip groove.
not a massive fan of name droppers either strikes me an an insecurity thing if you cant stand up to your convictions
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Post by hannahdudey on Feb 2, 2011 13:04:28 GMT
thanks for everyones comments and input really appreciate it  good luck with all of your horses and competing or whatever interests you! xx |
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Post by scattymare on Feb 2, 2011 13:05:51 GMT
No not common sense - completely barking. The grackle will stop the curb action completely. So pointless.
So do you ride in the same equipment when schooling on the flat?
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)
for so much hard work we thank ye!!
Or am I thinking of the wrong noseband...a grackle is that cross-over X-shaped thing isn't it?
Am not against the use of grakles, flashes, pelhams etc but dont see how they can go together. 
good luck with all of your horses and competing or whatever interests you! xx