barefoot vs shoes

[brigadier]

HI Everyone
Ive got basil unshod behind and shod in front, he's got good feet and Ill be doing more schoolwork with him than roadwork, prob hack out 1/2 per week max.

After sitting out the past week because he has spread a shoe and waiting for farrier (could take it off but crappy wrist so dont want to risk it) Ive been trying to make my mind up about unshod all round. the farrier is here on Wednesday so I need to make a decision by then. I think his feet are up to it but will it effect him for fast work/ jumping/etc etc.

Peoples experiences would be useful- my mate has her horses unshod but they always seem to be a bit footy so this is putting me off!

cheers in advance
Brig

[kateflashy]

all ours are barefoot and we dont have any problems

though a couple did take a few months for there feet to get used to it but ive competed all of them shoeless for a while

[Blonde Donkey]

savvy is barefoot and now has better feet than she has ever had before.

[racaille]

Hmmmm, I'm also trying out barefoot. Paco has always been shod. He has whte feet and I've always believed them to be more fragile than dark, but I'm not even sure about that now because he has good feet despite the stony work he does and many of the other horses have cr@p feet despite only working on soft surfaces. But it's not broke and I ain't fixing it, as I hope to get away into the mountains this summer (having been unable to do the Transhumance grrrrr)
But Racaille is staying unshod for the moment. Actually, our farrier is involved in the decision - he's great because he never shoes a horse unnecessarily (he came to shoe the silly mare last week but said her shoes/feet would be fine for another week). He told me to see how it goes when Racaille starts work this summer. He has hard little feet but we shall see whether they will hold up to the stones.
So I suppose the answer is to try it and see - there will be a period of adjustment, I imagine, in a horse that has been shod, but you can always put shoes back on again!

[abi]

whyat type is basil? how hard are his feet, how fast do they grow?

your farrier will advise you, but mines been unshod for two years with only one bruised sole. she has excellent feet, our farrier comes every 8th thursday, and just files out the small chips at the bottom, its loads cheaper and she has more grip on roads too.

however, the other mare is a TB, has very flat feet, and wouldnt survive without shoes! she gets very sore if she throws a shoe and prefers to stand on a mat when her shoes are changed, shes really sensitive and its just not worth taking them off! x

[haffyfan]

Mine are both barefoot (from birth) and cope just fine. Murph's feet aren't the best since he ahd lami but he still copes fine...odd crack but nothing major and this dry weather followed by very wet weather doesn't help matters much. He was also treated successfully for lami still barefoot at farriers recommendation. He dosen't ahve tb feet but neither does he have tough cob type feet. If Basil is coping behind I dare say he would be okay and clearly has decent feet for a tb. My farrier actually says if they crack barefoot then shoeing them will make them crack twice as bad! (I had wondered if shoeing would stop the cracks Murph sometimes gets)

I school barefoot and sometimes hack barefoot but where we are is very gravelly on most of the tracks we have to use when we set off so I use old macs all round as it protects the feet from excessive wear and also from bits of gravel tracking up and causing problems if you miss it. The boots are wonderful, fit well, don't rub and most importatly don't move/come off even in water/boggy ground or at speed! There worth getting if you do try barefoot even if only for the transitional period out hacking.

Your farrier is your best source of advice and any farrier worth using will be very supportive.
Some interesting reading here

www.barefoothorses.co.uk/

www.sportpony.com/Why%20barefoot.htm

www.barefoothorse.com/

www.thehorseshoof.com/

[brigadier]

Hi all, thanks for replies,
I think his feet will stand up to it- he is TB but he hasnt got flat feet and his hind ones have been ok (one of them is white also- I too have heard they are softer) He has persistant thrush in one of his front feet and I think more contact with the frog will improve this as to be fair the frog is a little withered. Its more the competing aspect thats making me dither, i know the road grip is good but its the grass grip that is making me think!
However like you say Racaille- if it doesnt work I can always have them put back on.
cheers again!
brig
x

[Blonde Donkey]

savvy works daily on grass and has never haad any problems
my mums horse is a tb and has great feet

[duckles]

Asked my farrier about this, he's not against barefoot and indeed advises us to go barefoot for 6 weeks every year for sake of hoof. He said my horse not up to (he has rotten feet and I would love to go barefoot) and not advisable for competition as he sees a lot of injured feet from barefoot competitors. Still, going by what everyone says on this site, he could well be wrong. I just wonder, why did they bring in shoes in the first place if horses cannot go equally well without them. I used to think it was just in the 19th century with all the hard roads that they brought in shoes, but apparently it t goes back centuries in northern europe (cus of climate). However, if he's ok of back feet, I'm sure he will be fine on front feet.

[trojanwarrior]

Warrior has been barefoot for just over a year and half & he still wears his hoof boots to hack out in. How well they adapt can depend on how long they've had shoes on for & the condition of their hooves. Warrior had dreadful feet, his coloured front ones being much worse than his stronger white hind ones. Because of his age and past problems, he may not be fully barefoot & still need front boots to hack out. I school him & ride in fields barefoot & his action is much better now than it was when he was shod.

If you do decide to try it, I'd recommend getting some hoofboots just to hack out in. The Old Macs are really good. Easy to put on and stay on through the heaviest mud.

[gnuton]

My boys have never been shod. I used a farrier who fully recommended and supported them going shoeless, but I made the mistake of having a so called 'barefoot' trained person do their feet once. My original farrier was retiring and I needed a new one. This 'barefoot' man was recommended to me by a fellow boarder but what I didn't know was they were living together, and all the 'training' he had was actually only a couple of clinics.

Within three weeks Jazz was tripping and on the verge of popping a knee and both he and Hunter had the beginnings of hoof separation.

Luckily enough we found another good, very well trained farrier and they are both fine now.

Other than the above incident both my boys have never had any problems with their feet and I ride a varied terrain; grass, sand, rocky, pavement, etc.

[Jen]

bloss is 18 and has never been known to have a shoe on any of her dainty little feet. unless she desperatly needs them she will never ever have them either, her feet are hard as nails and seem to refuse to wear down when out on long road hacks and rough terrain - strange pony!

try barefoot coz i agree with the others - you can always put them back on!

jen xx

[joandlad]

Best thing is to speak to your farrier and see what he thinks. Although you have to bear in mind that however "open minded" he is, he is running a business and you are worth more to him shod than unshod. My old boy was shod all his life and my new boy is shoeless so, even though I'm a DAEP I fully appreciate there are times when horses are better off shod and I will always say so.

There are a whole stack of things to take into account before going down the shoeless route. As a DAEP I do free initial consultations which review the horse, the owner, the environment, the diet, the workload etc, etc. Then I leave it to the owner to make a more informed decision about what they want to do. The majority of my clients manage happily without shoes but had we thought they would have problems we probably wouldn't have took them off in the first place. I, myself, use boots occasionally on Murph as he's doing mostly road-work now and his feet haven't been used to growing much to replace wear as they haven't been wearing much for the past 4 years. Once the growth rate catches up with the wear rate we won't need the boots anymore. It is, undoutedly, more involved (I did put difficult but decided that was not the right word!) to have a shoeless horse - you think much more about what you are doing with them. Unless you are very lucky you will have to go through some sort of transition period, but managed correctly you shouldn't have a footsore horse. Shod horses can stand on stones just as easily as a shoeless horse, but a shoe will allow the shod horse to carry on regardless (up to a point). I, for one, would rather know there was damage to my horses' foot so I could adjust my workload accordingly until it was better.

At the end of the day, you need to do as much research as possible and make an informed decision. So, you're already doing the right thing by considering it and asking for people's experiences. :-)

[haffyfan]

Jun 2, 2008 9:23:13 GMT joandlad said:

Best thing is to speak to your farrier and see what he thinks. Although you have to bear in mind that however "open minded" he is, he is running a business and you are worth more to him shod than unshod.

I have never found this a problem...after all he has no materials to account for, it's only petrol, trims can be very profitable indeed

[ceej]

Is it true that horses who have always been shod find it harder to go shoeless than those who have never worn shoes?

I guess some horses just have brittle feet? Gus at our yard only manages to keep shoes on for about 4-5 weks and his feet just fall apart without shoes. Is it the shoe causing this or are they just bad? she has tried farriers formula etc but it made no difference (cept to her wallet!)

I would like to have gone shoeless with harry but he has long toes and needs corrective shoeing so he doesnt trip up...we tried having no backs but they wore unevenly and he got a bit sore. Willow has never worn shoes but then he is a native pony - they are rock hard.

[joandlad]

Most farriers round my area charge £15 for a trim and £75 for a set of shoes. Even taking into account that they need a furnace, shoes, nails and more time there is considerably more profit in shoeing than trimming. Farriers actually need to put their price up for a trim. One of their biggest beefs is that DAEPs charge £40 and we are ripping people off. Actually, I think they are undervaluing their trims.

[haffyfan]

A set of shoes is a fair bit less round my way but trims more so I guess it's swings and roundabouts, but I think a lot of the trims are probably unaccountable if I can say that...ceej?...
I agree a lot of farriers do undervalue trims but you can see their point about DAEPS ripping clients off too. I would only let a qualified/registered person (farrier) near my horses feet and would not expect to pay twice as much (or more in some cases) for someone who has just picked up a rasp and done a quick course.

[brigadier]

I think Haffy Im with you on the trimming- I would always use a farrier to check the balance etc and then only a farrier I trust! Not sure about DAEPs. I would be just as informed myself re trimming etc and wouldnt consider doing it. No foot no horse- drilled into me from being a sprite!
brig

[ceej]

But then, I have come accross appauling farriers, and I only trust one who comes with numerous reviews...one I threw off my yard when he sent a nail into willows foot and sent him v lame. He was a complete bottom...fully qualidied and been doing it for years.

I dont think qualifications are everything- a good starting point yes, but must never be trusted blindly. Some 'qulaified' instructors shouldnt go near horses, and some with no paper qualifications who are brilliant...

Some farriers couldn't quite frankly give a damn about correct shoeing and will just whack a cold, ill fitting shoe on for speed.

I have no idea what training a DAEP has to go through, but I think its more than just a few clinics?

[jack]

jack had terable hoofs yet hated hot shoeing and hes a big boy when he doesnt like something so i tryed bare foot i use a normal farrier and jack feet have never been better though you have to give it a couple of months for thr transition if your horse or you dont like it you can allways go back to shoes

[brigadier]

HI once again thanks some really good advice. Ceej I completely and utterly agree and have seen supermarket shoeing by some farriers that has turned by blood cold! Luckily I completely trust the one Ive got and he has been maore than happy to not shoe him behind and will monitor the situation.
Ive made the decision today in anycase and phoned to arrange to have them off for weds.
As luck would have it, went to get him at tea time and yard owner was holding him on the lane whilst talking on her mobile- she was trying to get help to get him in as the spread shoe had completely spread and he couldnt walk- luckily I turned up and we got the tools and I took the thing off! tubbed his foot and no damage thank god- but its made my mind up completely- Dont want the hassle and Ill see how it goes- if anyone has a link for the hacking boots Id be grateful as would like to have a look but initially I will try to get him toughened up as I think he will!
Thanks thanks thanks!!!!Great advice has stopped me procastinating!
brig

[Blonde Donkey]

www.easycareinc.com/our_boots/boa_horse_boot/Boa_Boots.aspx
www.thesaddleryshop.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=832
there you go brig shopping time!

[brigadier]

Oh god- dont tell OH!
brig


thanks x have a karma (youve only got 5- whats the story youre always helpful and nice and positive methinks people are taking you for granted Savkins!)

[Blonde Donkey]

thanks i will give you one back when i can
i won't tell lol

[joandlad]

Haffyfan - I completely agree. I wouldn't pay twice as much either for someone who has just picked up a rasp and done a few courses. ;-) Just have to remember there is good and bad out there in everything. You just have to be informed enough to be able to make a decision about who is best for your horse.

Jo (DAEP)